tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31246093.post7552499773554022971..comments2024-03-28T12:29:39.157-07:00Comments on Graphic Firing Table: Skeptical InquirerFDChiefhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10607785969510234092noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31246093.post-77744982521661909792013-06-02T11:36:30.987-07:002013-06-02T11:36:30.987-07:00Chief says, "it's a 'Western economy&...Chief says, "it's a 'Western economy' issue" -- precisely. We are so limited by our perspective, and our religious legacy; we love the scapegoat. We love going bonkers over something ... it just feels so good to tribe-up and discharge our energy.<br /><br />And, when we "meet-up" at Starbucks (another corporate wizard) afterwards, we just feel so righteous (another h/t to religion). I think even the most pagan among us miss the origins of this urge to burn, and to remain basically impotent (the meek ...)Lisahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08839236994990699117noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31246093.post-36405756880979274172013-06-01T07:31:15.216-07:002013-06-01T07:31:15.216-07:00Barry: Very possible - again, I'm not saying t...Barry: Very possible - again, I'm not saying that the Illinois Ag. folks WEREN'T acting on behalf of Monsanto. Just that there's no direct proof one way or the other without knowing what the guy WAS doing and the article doesn't provide that.<br /><br />Labrys: Thing is, I'm not sure we KNOW one way or another the actual effects of GM organisms in human consumption, on the larger wheat genome, or in the larger biosphere as a whole. I'm not arguing "let's just GM the hell out of things". I'm saying <i>"Humans have done GM in the past through selective breeding, we now know it's possible in the lab - that genie's out of the bottle and won't be going back in, so the best option at this point IMO is NOT to get all panicky and fearful but to encourage MORE independent inquiry into these things and find out exactly what the implications and potential consequences are..."</i><br /><br />Leon: Agree - the nongenerative aspect is very troubling. There are a number of "troubling" aspects of the GM issue, among them we know so little about the interactions between GM and non-GM organisms...<br /><br />bb: But, again, that conflict isn't a "Monsanto" issue, it's a "Western economy" issue. So long as Western societies depend on mass-produced, cheap food products then there will be Monsantos or companies like Monsantos producing this stuff. The degree to which they are capable of short-sighted behavior in pursuit of short-term profits will only be limited by the degree to which "we the people" or our governments choose to limit them. As you and Leon point out, the Europeans are taking a much more cautious approach this this problem. I tend to favor that approach, but the issue in this country is wrapped up in Left vs Right politics and so is as toxic as most Left vs Right politics at the moment...FDChiefhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10607785969510234092noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31246093.post-51241729346574811682013-06-01T00:56:17.758-07:002013-06-01T00:56:17.758-07:00Much of the friction is due to the conflict betwee...Much of the friction is due to the conflict between corporate v. traditional family farm food production values and processes.<br /><br />F'rinstance, many farmers will siphon off their best field production and sock it away in a storage bin for the next planting, like wheat, corn. Good for the farmers but not so good for the corporate seed producers, who are interested in maximum profit and minimum costs. Farmers have always enjoyed some degree of freedom in their life, planting as they like and working at their own schedule, as the banking and insurance interests and federal/state governments allow them to be. That activity is risky, but it is our food we're discussing here, very essential stuff.<br /><br />The problem as I see it, is the same with any human endeavor, so easy to be short-sighted.<br /><br />Unintended consequences. So the valuable crop Monsanto develops geneticly to be resistant to herbicide becomes next year's incurable weed. Or the crop that produces its own pesticide kills off all insects, including the bee.<br /><br />Humans may be able to do it, but I think it will be very difficult to make our natural environment conform to the corporate model.<br /><br />So yeah, Fuck Monsanto 8 ways to Sunday come ta meetin'.<br /><br />bb Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31246093.post-63020324019945710202013-05-31T10:13:17.317-07:002013-05-31T10:13:17.317-07:00I've read a comment on Reddit (that I now can&...I've read a comment on Reddit (that I now can't find damnit) that suggests the European protests against Monsanto was due to the American company's products work best for the US factory farms as opposed to Europe's more prevalent family run farms. Or something like that.<br /><br />I stumbled onto the march in Toronto on my way to the market and was surprised by the number of people with biblical interpretations on why GMO is eeeeeevyl.<br /><br />My issue with GMO's (and my information is probably dated) is that they can't reproduce - that is you can't take part of your harvest and sow it for the next season, you must buy more from Monsanto. I consider this a disaster waiting to happen. If for any reason Monsanto isn't able to supply farmers with new seeds, our food supply of wheat is interrupted, cue soylent green jokes.Leonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15715768191516712688noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31246093.post-4014742988580576572013-05-31T08:03:13.075-07:002013-05-31T08:03:13.075-07:00I don't know what the bee guy was really doing...I don't know what the bee guy was really doing; his bees were seized because they were said to be infected with something transmittable...leaving them could have endangered OTHER bee stocks. Of course, whether that was TRUE, is anyone's guess. In Europe, the testing of bees for sensitivity is done over GENERATIONS and they DO find bees more vulnerable. Here? If the bee doesn't crawl thru the test-shit and die on the spot, it's all good. Obviously, a bit simplistic.....and our bees are dying while Europe's bees are beginning to recover; they BANNED some of the insecticides our EPA says are "safe". All I know is, my bees died, hauling out dead larvae first and succumbing to colony collapse. <br /><br />Selective breeding of crops and stock IS old as the hills, genetic modification is not and we really do not know what it does to us. I avoid more and more wheat because it makes me sick, for instance; because it is NOT the wheat I ate growing up. <br /><br />Monsanto is not trying to poison us; they are trying to make money and IF it poisons us slowly along the way, they don't give a damn. They can kiss my round pagan nature-loving ass.Syrbal/Labryshttp://www.herlanderwalking.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-31246093.post-11787630907186486002013-05-31T07:18:14.057-07:002013-05-31T07:18:14.057-07:00Actually, there could be a quite good reason - thi...Actually, there could be a quite good reason - this guy is investigating the interactions between one of Monsanto's major products and bees. If he was proving that bees are *more* vulnerable than had been thought, Monsanto would not like that.<br /><br /><br /><br />Barry DeCiccohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04735814736387033844noreply@blogger.com